First off, let's try not to make this into a flame thread. I'm sure eventually Ponuh will come gay it up but until then, let's have a nice theological discussion.

Honestly, I DO NOT believe in any God. I am the typical "Science is god" person although I am very open minded and do my best not to talk down to others who are Christians. I'm a realist and the idea of a higher power that oversees the universe and created the Earth in 7 days does not sit well with me.

I don't want to see anyone calling anyone else stupid for their thoughts or feelings.

Just something to add. My father is a rather enthusiastic Catholic and when I was younger I went through First Comunion which is basicly studying the Bible and all that happy crap. Don't think that I have not read and understand the Bible. This isn't a conclusion that I just jumped...

I guess I believe a lot of what you do Matti. I have a hard time believing that everything was created in 7 days by some supreme being and stuff... I also went to CCD (Sunday school) for like 8 years and received my Confirmation and Communion and then went to Catholic school where I had Religion classes for 4 years... so my beliefs aren't out of not knowing anything either.

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Well, matti. I don't know how to explain it. But i semi agree with you. The idea of the world being created in 7 days just doesn't sit well with me either. In fact i think the bible is flawed in many ways also. Why ? Because its written by people. People aren't perfect. They lie they cheat they steal. I do believe some of type of enitity created us. But i'm betting it took millions of years for its fruits and labor to actually show up. And sometimes i think this entity just wants us to live.. Just enjoy life, nothing more nothing less

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Job 10: 20
The mikey's have a plan. Djay isn't all powerful.

I concur!

I'm in the same boat as hitman, I went through all that stuff, attended church every sunday until i was 14, and attended a catholic school and high school as well.

I just find it hard to believe one being created our world and the universe, and that to believe it there would need to be proof, in which we have none.

I also think it is rather egotistical to believe that god set aside so much time during the "7 days of creation" to create man.

Oh, and seeing some of things I have seen, I find it hard to believe that any god who truely loved his subjects would allow those things to occur to them.

my 2 cents!

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60 Undead Warrior *Coming for you C'thun!*
60 RDM Ifrit *retired*
10 BST Phoenix *leveling up!*

I believe more in aliens than the possibility of a supreme being thats spelt backward of dog.

I guess I'm also more optimistic type I guess.. I give thigns a chance until otherwise prooven. Maybe there is god who knows. But Even if thats the case I wouldn't be a follower. Unless "it" makes me a super famous chinese rap star like arthars.

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99 BLM . 75 mnk . 75 nin . 75 pld . 75 war . 48 rng . 41 rdm . 37 thf . 37 drk . 37 sam . 37 brd . 35 bst . 23 whm . 10 pup . 7 blu
http://www.myspace.com/hccmike

I do believe in god, but I don't believe most of the stuff in the bible. Science can't solve everything in my opinion.

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how do you not believe in god?

there is no proof if you think of it that way but if there is no god then how is there anything in the world?

and also if you would like more proof then ask any doc. who has had someone come out of a sickness that would have kill the person with out any medical proof that they did something to help the person.

that is just the way i look at this whole "god" thing.

pyro, how does not believing god exists mean that nothing in our world could exist?

there are many theories on how the world was created. Check out the big bang theory for starters, and go from there.

No flames, just happy happy posts =D

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60 Undead Warrior *Coming for you C'thun!*
60 RDM Ifrit *retired*
10 BST Phoenix *leveling up!*

There is no evidence of God. It's as simple as that. If there was hard evedince that a God exsisted; it wouldn't be called Faith.

Yes, Jesus exsisted and what happened to Jesus really happened. That can be proven but not the exsistence of God, don't get that mixed up.

but then how did anything that made that whole "big bang" theory work something can come from nothing

I agree with pyromancer. if there isnt a higher power, how did we come upon? im not religious at all although i beliveve in god but...whatever. i dont know. this discussion can go in about 92474892375932758927489237498274982374237498327472394792875982375927598493165076109632951696913659346591465936258230 different directions and im not wasting my time on it. bye.

There are no proof for it. But I don't mind to not doubt that there is a god though, since so many people need it for guidance.

I just want to know seriously.. Who the hell made god.. I mean is there another supreme being that give birth to god, the supreme being? Can god, the Supreme beings come from 2 other supreme beings doing the nasty? Or does the supreme being itself just pop out of no where?

example: Did the first supreme being lay an egg first? Or did the 2nd supreme being come out of an egg first?

Dammit!

My imagination don't just stop there.

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99 BLM . 75 mnk . 75 nin . 75 pld . 75 war . 48 rng . 41 rdm . 37 thf . 37 drk . 37 sam . 37 brd . 35 bst . 23 whm . 10 pup . 7 blu
http://www.myspace.com/hccmike

I was afraid this would come to a point where someone would say that. Unfortunately that is something that can not be answered. It's just like the "Which came first? The chicken or the egg?" thing. No one was around to document so no one knows for sure.

Matter came from matter. Once a Universe collapses then you are left with small amounts of matter moving inwards on each other. This increases it's density utill it becomes so dense it explodes and thus matter is spread far and wide resulting in a new universe.

Don't have that attitude.

No one is trying to change your mind. I just wanted some input from others as I'm POSITIVE different people have different reasons for believing in or not believing in God.

i have the same idea as Hcc

i was just thinking about that last night but there has to be somthing after death not just "death"

:arrow:

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75WHM / 37SMN / 61BLM / 37RDM / 70BRD / 75NIN / 75RNG / 56THF / 37WAR / 37DRG http://www.myspace.com/dan_wyld

haha yea I know Matti

I'm really an Athiest that gives "god" a chance though. I don't like being close minded, because really, human imagination dont' just stops there.

If there have to be a god, for the time being since its not proven yet, there fore its still an imaginary figure. Then, WHY JUST STOP THERE? Why just stop where you must follow that tradition.

Why can't god be the little voice thats called Concience thats always follow besides you.

But the main thing we need to figure out, did god pop out of an egg first, or did god lay an egg first... Then we can continue imagine different choices of imaginary hypothsis.

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99 BLM . 75 mnk . 75 nin . 75 pld . 75 war . 48 rng . 41 rdm . 37 thf . 37 drk . 37 sam . 37 brd . 35 bst . 23 whm . 10 pup . 7 blu
http://www.myspace.com/hccmike

Science as it is now is a religion into itself. We believe in it just like people of other modern believe in their religions or even how people used to have faith in Catholicism. The parallel between science and religion is there, and neither really offer much in terms of answers. Most people can recite basic science knowledge, but how many people understand it. Heh. The big answers are still unknown factors, like why and how the universe was created, why there is life known to one planet out of the trillions and trillions. If you've studied it, the conditions for life as we know it to even exist are even impossible. There's "answers" that we're given, but I'm not really satisified by them.

The basis of most organized religions is faith, and unlike with science, they don't really try to explain them since if you're a believer, you're supposed to have faith in things that defy logical explanation. The new testament of the Bible was written like, 200 years after Christ's death, when supposedly it was the writings of his apostles commenting on his life and times. Stuff like that doesn't really matter to people, just because if you do believe, do it without question and you'll be rewarded. That doesn't really sit right with me either.

I suppose what I believe is.. science can teach us some neat things but shouldn't really be taken like it is the word of a god or whatever. And mass religion is just a tool to make the masses obey through hope and faith. If there is a god of some kind, and he did create us and this world out of love, then I do feel it is worth the love and faith people give their "God" even though it can be misguided. Regardless, if something makes an individual happy and able to live their lives... it's a great thing. Because to me, there isn't much to have hope in and no real reason to strive for life. Some find hope in their friends, family, work, religion, science or whatever. I suppose I'm pretty selfish when I say I live for me, and not for any ideal that isn't my own.. I'm sure that'll change when I have my own family some day. If I have my own that is. I just want to be free. Heh.

Without religion, people would go on living without any real purpose. The hope for another world that's greater than this one is too appealing to abandon for alot of folks. I guess that's why in the Bible Belt so many try to discredit science to the point of saying it's evil. It threatens the way they live and the ideals that they've set up for their communities and families. I've read the Bible numerous times since I was a boy, as well as most of the major doctrines of the big religions and ya. Religion is something nice to have faith in, but the world we live in seems to be ruled by three opposing forces. Christianity, Islam and science. Who knows how that'll turn out. Heh. I don't really like it when a belief is forced upon people, like how Christianity and Islam do. There's too much bloodshed in the world already, we don't really need any more wars based on differences on faith.

If there's one thing I'd like to believe in for sure, is that all people are basically good. It's just a matter of cirumstance that changes them.

Flame me if you want, I'll just cut your throat.

Freaking perfect, Rein...

"I don't have the evidence to prove that God doesn't exist, but I so strongly suspect that he doesn't that I don't want to waste my time."
-Isaac Asimov

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The lovers, the dreamers, and me.

Good read rein,

I dont live by it, but i have extreme respect for things stated in the bible.
Not because its written in the bible, but because i have experienced
things that stated and shown many times in the bible.
Though i havent been to church in years, and practically my
christian thoughts and actions are no longer exercised by me, i was
once a person who lived by whats said in the bible.
For those of you who have read the bible, you are very aware of
directions written on it, some are simple to go by in our everyday lives,
but some are a great conflict with things we want to do, see and say.

The main reason why i have lost my christian will and habits were due
to friends. I'm in no way blaming them for my actions, but it was
the influence they offered, that made the scapegoat i looked for as
my excuse. I really wish to go into details about my life experience
in this subject, but i'm afraid to be made fun of and afraid most of
you wouldnt understand. I miss the days when i used to go to church
and the days i used to live by these "rules", but sometimes i think i'm in too
deep of a whole to try crawling out.

800 posts again. back to 4 months ago. =p

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Ugh I just went through that crap yesterday. What a pain in the ass all the stuff you have to do for that is. I guess that kind of stuff gave me the attitude I have now.

I've been a Catholic all my life, but that's just because my parents are and I have no choice. I've gone to a Catholic school all my life (grade school and high school currently), which I am actually quite grateful for going there rather than a public school. But even so, I've never really cared for religion. I have my own religion, called "not really caring" Bad attitude I guess, but I don't really care. With the exception of forced holidays, I haven't gone to church in like 4 years, I've never prayed in my lifetime except at school, and I don't follow that BS about not eating meat on Fridays or whatever, as well as the other dumb stuff (JUST MY OPINION).

As for God, I assume that there is some supreme being, but if there is, then I feel he shouldn't care about going to church or not eating meat or whatever. I figure that as long as you're generally a good person, then if there is a God, then you should be rewarded. If there is no God, oh well I lose. Like I said, I don't really care.

one thing alot of people don't realize, and i know some of you may not agree with me. But the religion itself, was created to control the masses.. Think about that? Go over the ten commandments.

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Job 10: 20
The mikey's have a plan. Djay isn't all powerful.

At least its nothing harmful.

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