But every server has the same mpk grudges and everything else, and Tiamat is a big waste of time wether you're on ifrit or asura or carbuncle, yet why does nobody seem to care about him here except smn zergers

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Its because this server doesnt have enough dedicated players.


I think the reason is pretty simple. Ifrit is one of the original FFXI servers. This server was a high population server when the NA launch was done. Fewer people are put on ifrit than other servers.

Have you ever noticed how long it takes for Ifrit to keep up with other servers? On top of that we have\had KFC that had a strangle hold on the HNM Scene and kept everyone else (including CKD out).

Im a little guilty too. I discouraged most NA linkshells from doing HNMs. I did as much bad PR for every other HNMLS to keep them down as much as I could.
I mean no one really thinks I cared that much about TTK do they? I couldnt even name you 5 people from that linkshell.

So my point is that the reason we dont have people doing the same stuff as on other servers is because this server has had a lot of obsticals to overcome. Once we finally got past the obsticals, the HNMs were pretty anticlimactic. Atleast I remember it being that way.

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COBRA KAI DOJO NEVER DIES
RIP Shiloh

About "elitist" linkshells, and mainly a response to Jim/Deejay.


Even in Dynamis you probably don't need any more than 25 people to get alot done. Sev's Dynamis just beat Dynamis-Windurst with like 21 people last week, so, with the right strategy any some damn good pulling anything is possible. So, as far as numbers there hasn't been a huge incentive to invite people, but the bigger reason here is loot management.

A huge philosophy behind CKD that carried over into Atariii was taking care of the members it already had. Let's use red mages for example. RDM No.1 joins at the founding of a HNM shell. They invite people so on and so forth until they have 12 people with Red Mage jobs. If the shell's first A.body drops off Nidhogg how many of those RDMs do you think want to lot that? Ideally the first RDM should get it, however, time and time again older members have been shafted for some screwed up situations. Now, between a linkshell with maybe four or five RDMs its more realistic for each of those RDMs to support an order for the first RDM to get an A.body, and even if you were the last RDM in line for an A.body you might not feel as totally discouraged as being number 12. This helps the idea that those four or five RDMs are members of a family that cares about them. Like what Yarr said above, I think this makes alot more sense for players on Ifrit since getting HNM drops has been just so freakin' hard on this server, haha

Its alot harder to please a linkshell of 40+ 50+ people. I hope I summed that up well :p Its not nessecarily about elitism, but about taking care of your own.

Thanks Supa btw, I had forgotton about Vaelen and FS involvement in Cheeseburgers. lol too bad that love didn't last.


This, I had always thought, was also a big influence although I never knew for sure or not.

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Retired 8/21/06
Don't click this link.

Yeah and its that "caring" (or Greedy as I always though) way of doing things that lead to so many problems.

The best example is the Runefury\haidate issue.

Talisin and Runefury had been waiting to get haidate for ever. They wanted it on their BST but no one would give them priority. Lets not forget that BST is the hardest job to level and they had been 75 for a few months. Longer than most the ninjas who wanted haidate. However since Ninja's always got priority and since people were constantly leveling 75 ninja's Talisin and Rune kept getting shoved back down to the bottom of the list.

So what did Runefury do? He had a ninja that was already level 60 so he grinded. He put some serious work into his Ninja and managed to get it to 75 in a fairly short amount of time. After hitting 75 he did Byakko and lotted on the haidate (He couldnt care less about his Ninja he wanted them for his Beastmaster.) He was up vs Claudia, Kurokaze and Galindar. Galindar being the person who really should have got them btw. They all lotted and Rune was in first place and Galindar was in thrid (iirc). Rune would have passed for Galindar but that wasnt the problem here.

Anyway people freaked out over it. Why? Runefury should have got them for his beastmaster. I dont care what job its better for. This is a game and its all pretend loot. Priority should have been done based on who leveled what job first. Runefury had all of those people beat with his beastmaster.

Yet this small little issue turned almost the whole linkshell on Rune. I mean seriously. Rune had a poll put up by me at 9AM in the morning. Around 5PM when I got home from work it had 30+ yes votes and 0 no votes. In the history of CKD he had by far the best poll I have ever seen.



The problem with this server is that its greedy. Linkshells are small because they dont want to roll vs a high number of people. Linkshells hack so they can get loot first.

I hate this game. I hate what it brings out in people.


oh and my thoughts on the rune\haidate thing are not up for debate.

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COBRA KAI DOJO NEVER DIES
RIP Shiloh

lol yeah, in a perfect world my above example would hold I guess, but like alot of things they're always examples that say otherwise. I'm not sure I know of a way that we could've done things differently since you can't force people to be respectful all the time. People want their ideal gear, end of story, and we did the best we could I think. I know other shells on other servers will let just whatever go to people who put in the most time, or distrubte loot more evenly to try to make people happy. The Runefury/Tal thing was unfortunate. I still don't hate either of them, and I never really have. It just goes to show the more people you have with the less loot to go around the more drama your going to get.

I dunno, how the hell do you make people happy in this game that throws you a bone only after four hours of staring at a monitor.

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Retired 8/21/06
Don't click this link.

Its easy. Never let loot become the objective. I never did. My goal was always the kill. I never cared about Shining Cloth, I never cared abou gil. The only gear I really wanted was the stuff no one else did. Well I did enjoy AF2, but I never asked anyone to pass or crap like that.

If people enjoyed the game on a different level (The one it was intended to be) than things would be different. This game was not designed as a game you collect loot in. If it was we would be collecting a lot more loot. This game was designed around Missions, Leveling and the occational HNM fight.

Games like WoW are centralized around loot. Theres tons of it. Ive been playing for almost 6 months and I still find loot Ive never heard of or seen before. I can be as greedy as I want because there arnt 300 other people trying to get the same piece of loot as I am.

When I played FFXI I came from DAoC (a PvP game, where there are no HNM mobs, there are no big drops. All loot is crafted and stats are put on the crafted loot with Jewelcrafting). So I had no problem just getting whatever gear and dealing with it.

Still, this game has a strangle hold on most the population and for some reason everyone keeps their targets and objectives as loot. Another problem with this is that once people get this loot its pretty anticlimactic. It normally leaves them feeling kind of crapy (winners remorse?) and they tend to feel like they should quit.

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COBRA KAI DOJO NEVER DIES
RIP Shiloh

exactly Yarr. I started playing this game because a few irl friends started playing it and my first guild consisted of all irl friends. I can honestly after the 3+ years of playing and all the lewt/gear I've aquired that the best times I've had in this game was when I was doing stuff with friends... whether it be lvling together, khazam keys, af missions, or w/e...

I think that's why a lot of hnmlses fail.. because they have members that are hopping away from other lses with strictly loot on their mind (this is why i am so adamant and outspoken about lshoppers and people whom i once considered my friends who turned their back on me) The bottom line is if you're playing for some e-penis+1 gear you're going to be disappointed time and time again. No one cares, in fact, most people are such jealous bitches that they won't cheer you on or brag about you like you think they're going to, but slam you and call you some gilbuying loot whore or equivalent

The only enjoyment that's derived from this game is having a group of people whose personality and company you really enjoy. If you can find that, then you can have fun doing anything in this game.. and I think that's kinda how it was meant to be played and how it was built. Most things require 12+ people. Why is that? Maybe because se wanted us all working together instead of creating little tiny elistist cliques and waging wars against eachother. Someone was saying before how other servers do well because they have a few hnmlses consisting of many as opposed to ifrit which has a lot hnmlses consiting of few.

And it makes total sense if you have a group of 50 ppl who just enjoy going to and doing events and aren't concerned about gear... because they know it eventually will come around to them, and the 50+ ppl all get along with eachother.. than omgz ppl might actually be happy when one of their lsmates gets gear instead of being dicks about it (like in the runefury case) and omgz they'd be able to accomplish a hell of a lot more in a lot shorter amount of time... but you know, these are things i've been saying forever, and no one's gonna change.

so let the wars continue

EDIT: Also, just thinking about it, how many hnmlses on ifrit lose members or get into fights because certian ppl don't want to do certain events while others do? In a hnmls operating underan umbrella of 50+ members you could easily let the ppl who want to exp, exp, and the ppl who want to do sky, do sky, and the people want to do dynamis, do dynamis, etc w/o affecting the rest of the ls and jopeardizing their own standing in the ls by not attending "mandatory" events

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You bring up some interesting points Jim. What I got out of your post made me think Ifrit's real problem is not letting people treat the game like a game. It's all in the LS environment, if you're not having fun with your LS, then there's something wrong there. You're right, if a LS has more people, then more people can do the things they want, and more people will be happy with how things go.

Mandatory events seem to make people jaded about the game. Like Dynamis for one, if your LS does it twice a week and makes it mandatory for people to show up, when your ls members wish to be doing other things with their time, you're gonna see poor results on the Dynamis, simply because people get tired of doing it. If you have alot more people to pool resources from, then you won't be asking the same people to come every time you want to do a Dynamis.

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o_o The product of MNK73/THF25

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/profile.xml?72267

I'm glad I made this thread; I'm retiring Cad soon and I wanted to make a sort of "looking back" thread so people, as well as myself, can learn more from where this server went wrong and what it did right.

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Retired 8/21/06
Don't click this link.

Well thats going to happen in any LS Cad, drama over loot is something that happens with all shells, regardless of size.

The only real thing i was trying to point out is the fact every big LS on this server praises that theyre a tight knit group, and pushes for the whole 'family values'.

Deadlegend brought up the point that they have their very own token DRG, and are very open when it comes to recruiting. But if you look at their recruitment forums, it says in BIG BOLD MEAN LETTERS TO NOT APPLY IF YOU ARENT A BLM/SMN/RDM/BLU/OMG/WTF/COR

I mean, poor jimbean had to go through hell and back just to get a chance to prove himself in CKD. I'm not going to delve to deep into that subject though because this isnt a drama thread, but you get my point.

Its not my LS, so i cant make the rules. But all im saying is that if you took a second to consider a person's character rather than their jobs/mission status/crafts maybe it would be easier to accomplish all the big shit.
(Relic weapons/dyna-xarc-tav/AV)

Now dont get me wrong, im not saying that you should invite any mumbo jumbo nice guy into your shell, im just sayin that when you have people who make it obvious that theyre not in it for the loot, but just to be part of something special (or just for some good ol' fun)Why not give them that chance?

Now before eternus banishes me to zam again, i never once implied that you guys couldnt do any of that stuff on your own. I was simply stating that if you guys gave some of the good people on this server a shot, maybe it would help your LS grow into something people talk about serverwide.

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Usually charecter is what is considered first of all. I can't recall one application I've gone through that hadn't advertised a "nice guy" with "good charecter" to some extent besides the ones that did something stupid ages ago that someone remembered. Plenty of "nice guys" get rejected not because people hate them, its just because the linkshell doesn't feel they have a place for them. Good charecter helps you get into a shell, but really what essentially it boils down to is what you can contribute to the shell, and if the leaders decided they want the shell small then it will be selective. Not to return to the Jimbean issue again, but he just really damned himself by making so much drama.

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Retired 8/21/06
Don't click this link.

I just gave my opinion always trying to be as nice and specific as possible, it wasn't until after the rejection that I said fuck these dudes and went off a lot. I was originally rejected mostly because of my stupid emo posts in the irl section (and cad this is before you were in ckd, so you can't say you know for sure), though i don't know what being lovesick over someone has to do with my performance in a videogame. Truth is I'll never really know what it is about me, because no one actually said specifically what it was, I heard a few different things and I have a few theories of my own. The only thing I can say for sure is it had nothing to do with my skill as a player.

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I don't think there's anything specific about the people in Ifrit that makes us lazy or anything. It's just kinda the way things worked out. CKD was the most famous NA HNMLS for a while, and they decided they wanted to keep it small and do their own thing. On top of that, they had people that left and made their own shells (Aiame and DB for example). Everything got segregated real fast. And now it's gotten to the point, as mentioned before, that people want their loots, and they're not gonna get them if they're lotting against like 1000000 other people, so we have lots of smaller LS's

Nah, I don't know for sure about your first application or what people thought, but the impression I got from when I saw and commented on the next application was as you said: you put yourself in a vulnerable position, were rejected, got pissed off, caused drama. Caused drama with other shells, caused drama on the forum, etc. Like I said I think people never thought favorably was because it seemed like you caused drama every where you went. So, your right, it had nothing to do with your skill as a player, it was your ability to work and communicate with others without Drama Torama popping. And I could be completely, totally wrong and maybe everyone didn't like you because you made those posts on the irl board. This just my two cents.

Anyway last post on this old drama swear to God, lol Any more comments about this post please PM me, cause I won't respond on this thread anymore.

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Retired 8/21/06
Don't click this link.

You'd be retarded to think everything is lodi dodi and carefree in giant linkshells on other servers. All the big big problems come into play there as well. You may find yourself excluded from SKY, Land Kings etc etc because people already have the people they need. The same 5-6 people would become close knit and xp and would exclude themselves from the LS. Multiple leaders would make for multiple problems etc etc. Even making a rep for yourself as an individual would be difficult in a bigger ("who are you again?") shell. ProjectEndgame was a giant shell merger of 2 smaller shells and we see how well it did. I was proud of being a part of it though since I met some kickass people like Yakum and Drak and Fudan.^^ However all servers, all shells, and everything in between has their problems so don't let the outside PR of a shell influence you into thinking that everything is dreamy on the other side of the rainbow. Also take everything inot perspective. If dy-Lord is being farmed and these shells do it on a regular basis, think about either how old they are or if they really do much else as far as variable stuff. CKD, FS, and a few of the other tighter shells have tried and accomplished just about everything the game has to offer with a good number of their own players. So ask yourself, do you really want to farm the same pop (whether it's dynamis lord or not) over and over and over? It's was always cool killing Kirin the first 3 times but the 20th+ time after it became shitty. Without ToAU I'm sure a lot of people would have quit by now.

cad said this


Thats exactly what i wanted to say.. Too bad i'm a horrific writer.
But it got to the point that when you started kicking and screaming it damned you. Believe it or not i tried getting you in the ls jim, i tried and failed. I failed others too. Mrukk knows that i tried very hard to get exo into the ls. But it didn't work either.

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Job 10: 20
The mikey's have a plan. Djay isn't all powerful.

I really don't remember causing that much drama even before I applied the second time, shit I hadn't even applied to fs yet so the drama with fs was non-existant by that point. i left pd on good terms even though I was kicked.. same with tc. ttk is the only ls there MAY have been drama with, but that was all grim's fault. I never talked shit about ckd, I would add my opinion and sometimes people didn't like it. I may have flamed a few individuals, but no one that was especially well liked or respected in the community. The funny thing is you guys call me a hypocrit and a drama starter... but really, how many threads were there back in the day of ckd vs fs and ckd vs ttk etc. etc. I thought it was DAH COOLEST thing to do. holy backfire batman

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The best thing to do in this game is be quiet, hunt thunder elementals, and make linen 5 hours a day. :D

Playing solo never killed anybody. lol

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Some stories can't be told with words, some legends are meant to die

>_> It does tend to make people somewhat insane. . .

Don't mind me . . . /returns to his thunder elemental hunting.

o@;

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o_o The product of MNK73/THF25

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/profile.xml?72267

omg i used to spend hours in Upper Delkfutt's on the 10th floor skilling up weapons to 100 and farming thunder crystals. by the end i wanted to end my life lol

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WAR75 BLM75 PLD75 DRK75

Shadow Ring 5/13/06

i wish i had a weapon to skill to 100 so i can go back to the good ol' days

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WAR75 BLM75 PLD75 DRK75

Shadow Ring 5/13/06

Yeah running from floor 9-8 and back up it was fun to learn the exact pop rhythm and figure out the perfect spell setup to kill them as they pop and get back to the starting point with a minute or 2 to rest. Then you get to the level where you can one shot them, and it's not quite the same.
Glory to the days of 35 clusters in 90 minutes at level 60, before spinning key item! People got to know me as the weirdo on the windurst dock because I'd be there all friggin day making linen. I hated the goddamn woodworkers making multiple lumbers in one synth >:/

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Some stories can't be told with words, some legends are meant to die

I hated doing anything solo, I lived in ffxi for interaction with other people.


Doing a quest/farming/exploring was all just boring boring boring on my own, and generally would result in me falling asleep, literally just saying "fuck it" and walking 2 steps to my bed. I'd wake up 2 hours later to check chat logs and often nobody talked to me as 99% of my friends lived in a diff time zone to me and were at work/in bed when I was in my prime time.

Man how did I ever keep playing so long lol, most of the time I was just logged in and sleeping irl.

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soloing sucks ;p
since people liked my awesome skillz and personality never had to solo hence i suck(ed) at it, too bad deadlegend has this problem of people not liking him and he is solo master



OMG jk me and deadlegend are cool now.

I thought it was Deadlegend not liking people? At least, that's what HE'D tell you ;p